NO products = Scam?

[dannyboy9]

"Nitric oxide is toxic at high physiological concentration where it appears to function as a cellular effector molecule that mediates both cytostatic and cytotoxic effect." [1]

"NO is generated in the course of inflammatory and immune reactions, both by macrophages and by neutrophils. The role of these cells is quite extensive, and includes phagocytic and non-phagocytic destruction of foreign or damaged cells. These processes involve the production of large quantities of NO, which is cytotoxic." [1]

"Although NO can be cytotoxic to tumour cells (as it is to other cells), it can also act as a carcinogen." [2]

"NO, a chemical radical, and its toxic derivatives can cause DNA damage and cell death in a variety of cell types. NO also has the ability to directly modify intracellular targets such as proteins and lipid-peroxidation products. NO produces cytotoxicity at high concentrations, whereas NO at lower concentrations may have the opposite effect and protect against apoptotic cell death from various stimuli. Therefore, regulation of NO production is vital for both cell survival and genome integrity. DNA damage triggers p53 protein accumulation, which produces either growth arrest or apoptosis. Exposure of cells to high NO concentrations causes DNA damage and apoptosis, and recent results have shown that NO stimulates p53 accumulation and p53-mediated apoptosis." [3]

[1] The enhancement of the hyperglycemic effect of S-nitrosoglutathione and S-nitroso-N-acetylpenicillamine by vitamin C in an animal model | BioMed Central - Mirror @ Uni Potsdam

[2] http://www.clinsci.org/cs/098/0507/0980507.pdf

[3] Up-regulation of inducible nitric oxide synthase expression in cancer-prone p53 knockout mice -- Ambs et al. 95 (15): 8823 -- Proceedings of the National Academy of Sciences

[dannyboy9]

I would like to add that The NO products very often tend to be "mismarketed". What sucks is that most NO products contain caffeine which is what causes jitters. The jitters do not come from arginine but from high doses of caffeine that is added.the scam is not arginine but the concept in which is created by the marketing methods used by the companies themselves to sell their product. It seems that the NO products do not aquire the capability to significantly up-regulate NO production in the first place 1333% increase in anything sounds ridiculous in almost anything you talk about. Unless it's quality of sex then that's a different story Even then...you're asking for a heart attack with sex that good. Too much of anything is detrimental.

How many products have you come across that contain no caffeine. The ones I can think of off the top of my head is NO2 by MRI and VPX Muscle Nitrous Pump. I actually like VPX's MNP but it sucks that they use artificial flavors. I used it a couple of times and my endurance definitely went up, not to mention my intensity. It was a great experience, gosh I wish the old days at Mass Nutrition when I used to get it for free

[RJSMuscle]

I'm currently working on a jar of Ultimate Nutritions Horsepower NO supplement.

I like it because it's CAFFEINE FREE doesn't get me all jittery and light headed like NO xplode


and its cheaper too

[musclesntx]

I use straight Arginine, Ornithine and Lysine and I can tell a NOTICEABLE difference when I'm on and when I'm not.

[dannyboy9]

Originally Posted by RJSMuscle

I'm currently working on a jar of Ultimate Nutritions Horsepower NO supplement.

I like it because it's CAFFEINE FREE doesn't get me all jittery and light headed like NO xplode


and its cheaper too

I've heard about that product but I have never gotten to try it. I haven't seen it at any of the stores in my area and I've never been too aroused to order it online. Would you recommend it?

Originally Posted by musclesntx

I use straight Arginine, Ornithine and Lysine and I can tell a NOTICEABLE difference when I'm on and when I'm not.

I'm assuming you use them all together but separately or do you get all three in a blend? Do you buy them bulk?

[CraigC]

Originally Posted by musclesntx

I use straight Arginine, Ornithine and Lysine and I can tell a NOTICEABLE difference when I'm on and when I'm not.

How much of each do you take and when do you take it? What would be an appropriate starting dose for someone 180lbs, fairly lean?

I've been looking at some stuff on this site. Bulk Supplements Canada - Catalog - ClicShop It's not near as cheap as some of the US sites but I think it's the best I'm going to do in Canada. Think it's worth picking up some of those amino's from that site?

[CraigC]

And in response to the original topic I saw this over at AM. NO products = COMPLETE SCAM It shows a lot of the studies finding NO dangerous irrelevant to actual supplementation. Now whether it's cost effective, thats up to the user I guess. IMO it's not worth the money. Is it safe to assume that No Hype = danny?

[keater824]

i think i get a better pump eating oatmeal 20 mins before lifting; personally NO products just give me stomach issues

[dannyboy9]

Originally Posted by CraigC

And in response to the original topic I saw this over at AM. NO products = COMPLETE SCAM It shows a lot of the studies finding NO dangerous irrelevant to actual supplementation. Now whether it's cost effective, thats up to the user I guess. IMO it's not worth the money. Is it safe to assume that No Hype = danny?

C'mon now Craig. I can't honestly believe that you really think I'm NO HYPE or that I would even do something trollish like that. Anyways, I'm just going to leave it @ that cause this could get more ridiculous than it already is. I got this from NO HYPE's post on bodybuilding.com.

As far as NO HYPE, I believe NO HYPE has many interesting and mindful ideas and opinions which are [almost] always
backed up with solid proof and facts.

[CraigC]

Originally Posted by dannyboy9

C'mon now Craig. I can't honestly believe that you really think I'm NO HYPE or that I would even do something trollish like that. Anyways, I'm just going to leave it @ that cause this could get more ridiculous than it already is. I got this from NO HYPE's post on bodybuilding.com.

As far as NO HYPE, I believe NO HYPE has many interesting and mindful ideas and opinions which are [almost] always
backed up with solid proof and facts.

Alright, my bad. I tend to avoid bb.com so I guess I didn't know any better, and your writing styles are similar. Sorry about that.

[dannyboy9]

Originally Posted by CraigC

Alright, my bad. I tend to avoid bb.com so I guess I didn't know any better, and your writing styles are similar. Sorry about that.

I would understand why you tend to avoid bb.com. I check in every once in a while, most of the time just to update my Bodyspace. Don't worry about it bro - honest mistake.

[NiteHawk]

Dannyboy, I had a couple samples of Horsepower and didnt notice a thing. I personally wouldnt recommend it.

[dannyboy9]

Thank you for your feedback Nite. Highly considered and appreciated