will cardio reduce mass growth?

[JayFive]

Technically HIIT dips into glycogen stores while doing it, and causes a slight growth loss (unless you do it on a non lifting day and treat it like a lifting day).

The deal with it is that while you're dipping into glycogen stores slightly whil doing it, it allows the body to burn fat for the rest of the day whereas the long slow cardio (60%-70% MAH) will dip directly into fat stores while doing it but will rely on glycogen for the rest of the day.

Plus, the long slow cardio has to be exactly that- Long and Slow. You should be on the treadmill or whatever for a good 45 mins to an hour for any results whatsoever. Unfortunately, that's counterproductive to gains if you do it directly after a lifting routine because you need calories immediately after to help your growth and if you get calories then you'll just be burning them off immediately with a cardio routine.

My advice is this- do cardio if you want but don't rely on it entirely, you should take a closer look at your diet if you're gaining a lot of unwanted weight.

[BiggerGuns=LongerDrives]

Originally Posted by yumyumcat

You can do your cardio without losing mass as long as you don't go over your target heart rate.

The universal equation is this:
220
-age = Maximum Heart Rate. Now, take 60% - 70% of that number and therein lies your Target Heart Rate. You want to maintain this rate throughout your cardio sessions.

Let's say you're 25 years old. Your Maximum Hear Rate will be 195 (too high and burning muscle) what you want to do is keep it at rate will be in between 117 and 136.

Here's an easy way to keep track of it. Get on your machine and there's always a digital clock. Check your pulse on your cardioid artery. Use two finger and place them on your neck and find it. I'm sure you know where that is Now, just wait till the machine hits 00 or and count until 15 add 100 and say you count 128 beats. You're good to go. You're in between 117 and 136.

If you're serious about getting that dough off, go to the gym before you eat and do 45 minutes of stairs. Then go eat your breakfast

I do at least 1000 reps a day. There's tons of variations you can do just on the floor, nevermind with wings and off the ball, blah, blah, blah. If you want great abs, do them everyday.

Yeah but why worry about all that, why over complicate things with the heart rate, beats per min, color of socks you have to wear, etc?????

And why worry about sacrificing any gains at all?

If you dont want to overcomplicate things, want a shorter duration workout with more intensity and you dont want to sacrifice muscle loss, then look into HIIT like Jay mentioned.

You will get the fat burning you need without sacrificing muscle and you dont have to do all that long drawn out cardio in the process. The best part is that you can adapt HIIT to many different cardio sources, such as the bike, running, hills, track, jump rope, etc.


[EDIT] - I see Meta and Jay beat me to the punch again, never mind my post


.

[JayFive]

Originally Posted by BiggerGuns=LongerDrives

[EDIT] - I see Meta and Jay beat me to the punch again, never mind my post
.

My secret is... not doing any work while at work... it does wonders for the post count...

[Renegade68]

Nah - that is actually how target heart rate for cardio is figured out. It used to be printed on alot of machines.

Some "experts" say closer to 80% of MHR is better though.

[BiggerGuns=LongerDrives]

Originally Posted by JayFive

My secret is... not doing any work while at work... it does wonders for the post count...

Whoa! So I am not alone - LOL

[JayFive]

Originally Posted by Renegade68

Nah - that is actually how target heart rate for cardio is figured out. It used to be printed on alot of machines.

Some "experts" say closer to 80% of MHR is better though.

60-70% is approximately just about right between the 2 extremes. 55% is where it is said you burn fat. 75-80% is where it's actually stimulating your heart and lungs but dipping into glycogen for fuel.

I'm gonna quote and cite Boyd just because the guy explains it better than I can:

"-For fat to be the primary source of fuel, you need to be in the 55% MAH range
-Training in the 55% range does NOTHING to stimulate the heart and lungs.
-75-80% MAH DOES stimulate the heart and THIS is actually what is meant by "cardio".
-If done for shorter times, you will burn more total calories (and contrary to popular belief, more of those calories will actually be from fat than the slower version) with the 75-80% range." -quoted, Boyd Myers Understanding Cardio

"If done for shorter times" would be the example of why HIIT is so popular. You're training your heart and burning fat. While training at 60%, you are just starting to go over the fat burning point and at 70% your primary fuel, if you go for 45 minutes, is glycogen and you aren't training your heart optimally.

Of course, he also says the most efficient way to create a caloric deficit is with your diet...

[mitchcumstein]

To answer the original question will cardio reduce mass growth, the answer is no, it will actually help with mass growth if done properly. Cardio increases your protein turnover rate with allows you to process more protein, the key is you need to eat more to make up for the extra calories burned. But Ideally you should eat more extra cals than you burned doing cardio to take advantage of this. So if you were eating 4000 cals before with no cardio and you add -300 cals worth of cardio a day you should add say 500 extra cals to offsets it.

[yumyumcat]

Originally Posted by Meta

hmmmm... I'm not an expert in this area... but this seems wrong to me

going by that formula my target heart rate would 118.8 - 138.6

I've always been under the impression that the best way to burn fat without losing muscle is HIIT... if I'm doing HIIT my heartrate is gonna be above that for sure. I would have to do low intensity cardio in order to keep my heart rate that low. Sooo...

How old are you? If you're 25, that would be your target heart rate. There's not that much difference in our math.

HITT is great, the principle is not the same, but whatever works for you, then do it.

I've been a personal trainer and training people for over 15 years and I don't like telling people what to do, I just get them where they want to be.

As of right this minute, my b/f is 3.5% and will be less come the Master's Nationals in Pittsburgh In either event, cutting fat's not easy and I sure don't play games doing it.

[Meta]

Originally Posted by yumyumcat

How old are you? If you're 25, that would be your target heart rate. There's not that much difference in our math.

HITT is great, the principle is not the same, but whatever works for you, then do it.

I've been a personal trainer and training people for over 15 years and I don't like telling people what to do, I just get them where they want to be.

As of right this minute, my b/f is 3.5% and will be less come the Master's Nationals in Pittsburgh In either event, cutting fat's not easy and I sure don't play games doing it.

I'm 22, and that was the target hear rate I came up with based on your formula.

Based on the explanations from some other guys who posted, HIIT seems more ideal for me.

3.5% b/f is very impressive, props on that. I sure as hell can't say my b/f is that low, and I most likely won't get it that low. but I'm not competing, just tryin to look good on the beach or at the pool.

but yeah... I just started my cutting about a week ago, and it seems to be working so far. besides I hate cardio... it's boring as hell and after 15-20 minutes I've had enough of it, so HIIT is a much better option for me.

but obviously the other method works for you, so do what do.

[TheHorseman]

Originally Posted by VBigNate

This thread is hilarious. I remember Violin player when I first joined the site. Hrpii is a true horseman. I've personally met him and Boyd. They are two men with abundant bodybuilding knowledge that I would look to for insight. Oh, and back to the main topic, ab workouts will build the muscle under the fat, like Jay5 said. Cardio can hurt mass gains, but not if you have a proper diet. I have lost 50lbs in the last several months, and I have been able to retain all my mass and strength.

LOL @ Violin...

Cardio in huge amounts can fk mass gaining up. In moderation, it will help. It'll increase appetite, increase recovery between sets (try squatting heavy with poor wind), buffers lactic acid, speeds up metabolism and digestion, and a host of other benefits.

You have to train every muscle, and the heart is fairly important.

Nate, head East son. It's been 2 years now...

[TheHorseman]

Originally Posted by Meta

hmmmm... I'm not an expert in this area... but this seems wrong to me

going by that formula my target heart rate would 118.8 - 138.6

I've always been under the impression that the best way to burn fat without losing muscle is HIIT... if I'm doing HIIT my heartrate is gonna be above that for sure. I would have to do low intensity cardio in order to keep my heart rate that low. Sooo...

I haven't measured my heart rate in over 5 years...
MFers worry about trivial stuff way too much.

[Real Deal $teel]

Cardio depending on intensity and longevity can or will effect for gains somewhat, however the gains you may keep are a result of quality endurance along being much drier. It does deminish glucose so carb intake may be slightly increased to prevent slight muscle loss. Wholegrain I believe are essential for days of cardio, weight training even machines as followed for good energy and great for that feeling full sensation right before routine. Good luck and hope this helps